“I realized I was spending far too much time in the kitchen that I actually wanted to spend with my kids. I was overthinking other things while I was in the kitchen – about business and the kids. I was doing life admin in my head, and these things were driving me crazy. So I subcontract as much as I can.”
Anu Sawhney | Bidiliia
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Being a parent can feel like having a hundred different jobs.
So many chores to do, keeping your small humans alive and don’t get me started on the mental load – that birthday party present to buy, dentist appointments to book, and effing book day.
When all that’s done, there’s precious little brain juice left for your business.
So how do you create more time?
You could outsource – if you have the money.
You could insource – if your kids are capable and you have the patience of a saint.
You could buy a robo-vacuum to save a few precious minutes each day.
My guest today is a master at knowing where she can afford to outsource and make some more time to spend with the family.
She’s a smart, business human who prides herself on having an ethical ecommerce store, a mum to two children under 10, and a love of things sparkly.
In this episode, we’ll delve into some parental stereotypes, discuss the expectations placed on older siblings, the evolution of parenting styles, and just how hard it is to be a business-owning parent.
Tune in to learn:
- Anu’s family set up
- The differences between raising her first and second child
- Anu’s parenting style, and the importance of spending quality time with her kids
- How Anu went from working in the fashion industry to starting her own jewellery business
- When Anu focused in on her financials
- Anu’s biggest challenge balancing parenting and a new business
- Why Anu started outsourcing the household chores and cooking, and why it works for her
- Anu’s tips to be more productive
- How Anu fits self-care into her week
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About Anu Sawhney
Anu is a happy, kind human with an infectious zest for life. With a design degree in her bag, she set out to change how people feel, one design at a time.
After spending far too many years working for big brands she threw it all away for creating with kindness and selling without selling her soul. She brings her brightness and sparkle to life and believes, wholeheartedly, that happy people create happy things.
Through founding Bidiliia, her own ethical jewellery company, she found her love for experiential copywriting and marketing for good. She’s a storyteller with an inspiring story and is going places with her new found love.
Mum to two delectable humans, Anu lives in Sydney and is originally from India. She believes in thinking outside the box and being unshakeably persistent.
Fun Fact: Anu was born with 11 fingers, luckily the doc cut off the right extra pinky at birth.
Connect with Anu Sawhney
Useful Resources
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Transcript
Kate Toon:
Being a parent can feel like having a hundred different jobs.
So many chores to do, keeping your small humans alive and don’t get me started on the mental load – that birthday party present to buy, dentist appointments to book, and effing book day.
When all that’s done, there’s precious little brain juice left for your business.
So how do you create more time?
You could outsource – if you have the money.
You could insource – if you’re kids are capable and you have the patience of a saint.
You could buy a robo-vacuum to save a few precious minutes each day.
My guest today is a master at knowing where she can afford to outsource and make some more time to spend with the family.
She’s a smart, business human who prides herself on having an ethical ecommerce store , a mum to two children under 10, and a love of things sparkly.
In this episode we’ll delve into some parental stereotypes, discuss the expectations placed on older siblings, the evolution of parenting styles, and just how hard it is to be a business owning parent.
Hello, my name is Kate toon. I am the founder of Stay Tooned, a busy business owner and an okayish parent. And today I’m talking with Anu Sawhney. Hello, Anu.
Anu Sawhney:
Hello.
Kate Toon:
Hello. I’m gonna tell everybody who you are, you ready? Do you know who you are?
Anu Sawhney:
Hopefully.
Kate Toon:
That’s an existential crisis right at the beginning, who are you? After spending far too many years working for big brands, Anu threw it all away for creating with kindness, and selling without selling her soul. She brings her brightness and sparkle to life and believes wholeheartedly that people happy people create happy things. Through founding Bidiliia. They said it right her own ethical jewelry company, she found her love of x, very essential copywriting and marketing for good. She’s a storyteller with an inspiring story and is going places with her newfound love. She is mama to two delectable humans. And he lives in Sydney and is originally from India. She believes in thinking outside the box and being unshakably. Persistent. Oh, I agree with that let’s we your fun fact, is you’re born with 11 fingers. Luckily, the dot cut off the extra Pinky. Did you get to keep it?
Anu Sawhney:
No.
Kate Toon:
Oh.
Anu Sawhney:
It’s here. So there’s, well when you meet me in person, there’s like a little dent.
Kate Toon:
Not really working in the podcast to like, show your hand.
Anu Sawhney:
I know.
Kate Toon:
I think it’d be so cool if you kept it and could wear it like round your neck, like, you know, that would be really cool
Anu Sawhney:
No, I would never do that.
Kate Toon:
Or just having it in a little box.
Anu Sawhney:
No, I do have a friend who had the same thing and they cut off the wrong Pinky. She has like a permanently bent finger, which is kind of why I was lucky.
Kate Toon:
I kind of feel like you could have kept it and you maybe would have been better, you would have had more fingers for your rings.
Anu Sawhney:
That’s true.
Kate Toon:
That would have been something. I’d also like you know, I still feel the loss of my tail. See, I’m just sounding like a total weirdo. I hadn’t didn’t actually have a tail. Some people are born with tails. What I mean is I feel that that was a really poor evolutionary decision. I felt we could have kept them. Like I know we’ve got to stand up on two legs. But seriously, a tail would be so handy at the shops.
Anu Sawhney:
It would be.
Kate Toon:
Yeah.
Anu Sawhney:
And also tell the good to keep your back straight. When you’re sitting down.
Kate Toon:
It will be useful and so you know, I’m the sort of person who will not do two trips from the car. So I will take all 72 bags of shopping.
Anu Sawhney:
I do the same thing. Yeah.
Kate Toon:
Until like I’ve lost all feeling in my fingers. You know when your fingers like Yeah,
Anu Sawhney:
I like stuck them all the way up to my arm. Yeah. Then your hands and then you’re like, Why am I doing doing this?
Kate Toon:
Yeah, you’re so stupid. It wouldn’t be one more trip. But you could have had your keys on your tail.
Anu Sawhney:
And not in your mouth.
Kate Toon:
Yeah, so yeah, it’s it’s a big evolutionary mistake. So like you mentioned that you have to humans tell us, you don’t have to tell us everything about them. But how old are they? What are they like? You know, are you enjoying being a parent?
Anu Sawhney:
It’s off and on. Sometimes. I’d say 50 5050 I have an almost nine year old she’s nine going on 19. Yeah, rolls her eyes a lot. And I have a two year old with with so much energy. Like I don’t know why he gets it from.
Kate Toon:
From you.
Anu Sawhney:
He started running at like eight o’clock at night and he can’t stop. Like he literally was like slow motion super fast. And then he keeps doing that for like 40 minutes. I don’t know where he gets the energy from.
Kate Toon:
That’s that’s an interesting gap. I mean, that’s seven-year gap between the two of them.
Anu Sawhney:
One was intended, the other was a mistake.
Kate Toon:
Okay, let’s never say which ones which.
Anu Sawhney:
Not saying anything.
Kate Toon:
So, but that sounds it’s your own unique set of challenges as you said your two year olds full of beans, nine year olds on that cusp of tween them. And that seems to get lower and lower and lower. Like, you know, we all remember being a teenager, but I don’t remember being that bad until I was like 11. But now it seems to us that even, girls are different to boys. yada yada.
Anu Sawhney:
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, they are different. Yeah. But also girls, like one girl is different to the other girl and different to the other boys. So everyone’s different really, if you look at it from my point of view,
Kate Toon:
Absolutely. And everyone’s parenting style is different. You know, in the in the book, we cover off different types of parenting styles, but also the fact that even if you’ve got two children with a big age gap between them the way you parent one child is very different to the way you parent the other one like you know, people say, Oh, we both grew up in the same household. Why aren’t we the same? Because your parents are completely different. You nine years ago, when you first did your first kid, you’re like, I don’t know what I’m doing. Do you think your parenting style has evolved over the years or devolved?
Anu Sawhney:
No, it’s evolved. But it’s I think, um, it’s, it’s also this boundary that I have to create between my daughter and parenting. Because she gets a lot of flack for oh, you’re the oldest sister, it’s almost like an almost like you’re the other parent, and I have to go in until you’re not the other parent, this is not your responsibility. So I have to kind of deconstruct that whole thing and let her be a child at the same time, because she’s nine.
Kate Toon:
Yeah, I love that you do that though.
Anu Sawhney:
She’s so tiny. Yeah, because it’s like, she started getting that from pretty much the day he was born. And, and to me, it wasn’t okay. And I’m thinking now she’s not the parent. Like, none of this is her problem.
Kate Toon:
No.
Anu Sawhney:
None of these are her issues to tackle.
Kate Toon:
I love that you’ve had that conversation with her. And I do wonder as well, if that is often put more on older sisters than older brothers. I mean, older brothers are then supposed to set an example and look after. But you know, this is kind of implication that older sisters are meant to sort of take a little bit of the mothering role on and it’s like, Ah, you’re nine.
Anu Sawhney:
I know? Like, I don’t know. So my sister has two older kids, and they have that massive gap as well. And the third one’s a little girl, the older ones are boys. And, and their responsibility has always been to play. And that’s it. Like, they hold no responsibility towards her nurturing. And that’s how it’s always been. Now that she’s getting older, there’s this, there’s this thing of you can teach her if you want to, but not because you have to.
Kate Toon:
That’s a lovely distinction want to not have to because my brother, you know, taught me a lot, but I don’t think you ever felt compelled to do so. Now, there’s lots of categorizations of parenting styles. We’ve all heard of helicopter parents and Tiger parents permissive parenting, do you think you identify with a particular style? Or how would you describe? If you ever sat down and thought about how you parent? Before I wrote the book? I’m not sure I had, you know, and when I started reading through the different definitions, I was like, Oh, wow, you know, I’m a bit more that than I thought, you know, I thought I was the kind of parent that didn’t have huge expectations of their child. You know, it was a great commute. I mean, obviously, everyone thinks they’re a good parent, right?
Anu Sawhney:
Yeah.
Kate Toon:
Everyone thinks they’ve got great sense of humor, and it’s not true. And then I realized that I had a lot of permissive in me like I do, I don’t want my child to be upset with me, I do see him as a bit of a mate. And sometimes that leads to some sort of maybe poor decision making around kind of giving in when I should be standing strong. Have you sat down and thought about your parenting style?
Anu Sawhney:
I haven’t. But also, when my daughter was born, I kind of decided that I, I wanted to be the kind of parent who raises a child that she can then spend time with, as she grows older, and not have arguments and you know, random, like, actually talk about nice things, do nice things go to nice places. So we kind of split how we use our time when we’re together. And then you know, we’ll go to like, there’s one day every time she gets to pick what she’s doing. And I go by, by the by whatever she tells me. So this time, she wanted to go to the art gallery, the new art gallery, and I just kind of rolled along and I let her lead, because that is the time she gets to choose being the, you know, the decision maker. Whereas other times, she knows she’s not the decision maker, she can have a say, but that’s not her decision. So I don’t think I like I haven’t read the definitions. I just, I knew from the beginning that I wanted to raise a child that that would be good and making her own decisions. But also, I’d want to spend time with her because she’d be like half decent person.
Kate Toon:
It’s funny isn’t it.
Anu Sawhney:
Are we allowed to abuse.
Kate Toon:
We raised the question of you know, what makes a good parent in the group. And obviously, it’s so subjective. And sometimes, you know, when once you’ve read the book, you can come back to me and let me know what you think. But you know, I think it’s about putting down what’s important to you what you what values are important to you. And it can be big, big, sweeping things like I want to be able to communicate with my child, I want to like my child and want to spend time with her, which I really like. I’ve got a really silly one which occurred to me the other day. I always wanted to be the kind of mum that when my son has kids, friends come over, we’ve got like treats in the cupboard, crisps and nice drinks and stuff like that. Not necessarily home baked goods, because I’m not going to set the standard too high for myself. Let’s be realistic. But I always remember being little and going to my friend Hannah Oldfield’s house and her mom had treats you know, and we weren’t allowed stuff like that at home, so it just felt amazing. Now, does my son care? Does he even notice that I’m doing that? Probably not. But it was a metric for me, right? So some of the metrics are kind of throwbacks, obviously to your own childhood. And what does that mean? To me? It means that I thought about my kid, I’ve thought about how his friends feel I want his friends to feel comfortable our house. It’s funny, isn’t it? It bears thinking about, but not too much.
Anu Sawhney:
It is. I, I think one of the things that that I used to see was, so for me both my parents were working, they didn’t have the time to spend. So I was raised by two sets of grandparents. And my parents were in and out. And to me, it was the whole, I’d like to be able to spend time with her.
Kate Toon:
Yeah, that became your priority.
Anu Sawhney:
That became my priority. So I not just spend time with her for the sake of spending time, but spending quality time. And it wasn’t important that I was, you know, sitting with her 24-7 thing.
Kate Toon:
Buying things.
Anu Sawhney:
Yeah, yeah, it was more the experience and the time the time spent together, you could just go for a walk. But you’re spending time together, you’re talking, you’re without a gadget, you’re, you know, you’re discussing what’s around you.
Kate Toon:
You’re present your present. You know, I think that’s super important. We’ll come on to talk about that a bit more in business. Now, there’s a bit of a racial stereotype sometimes with Indian parents, that they can be quite, have quite high expectations of their children. Is that? Is that a racial stereotype that applies to you?
Anu Sawhney:
Not really. Not really.
Kate Toon:
That’s good.
Anu Sawhney:
It applied to me when I was growing up.
Kate Toon:
Oh I meant that, I meant your parents.
Anu Sawhney:
Yeah, so my parents, yes. But my parents also a lot of the times when they’re to action that there has to be. So when I set that standard for my daughter, it’s always then, what am I doing to help her achieve that standard? Because otherwise, it doesn’t matter. She’s not going to get there on her own. Yeah. And for me, there was the standard and expectation, it was way worse for my sister. So my sister before her grade 12 exams, I was sent off to stay with my, my stricter grandma. And she used to study for like, seven, eight hours a day.
Kate Toon:
Wow.
Anu Sawhney:
It is nuts. And it was because my parents thought she should get into medical school. And she did. And then she said, I don’t want to do this. It’s been difficult getting here that I don’t want to live this life.
Kate Toon:
Yeah, I’ve that’s not an uncommon story. I’ve when I went to college, do it. You know, a lot of my friends who were doctors kind of got to year two, and we’re like, why am I doing this? Oh, hang on. I didn’t. This is not my dream. Yeah. But it’s going to be pretty hard to see through if it’s not what I want. So that whole Tiger parenting thing, I think is a cliche, but I do think it still exists. So that’s the parenting side of things. From your business perspective. You know, I talked a little about your business Bidiliia. I’m a huge fan. You’ll find me all over any socials, because I think I bought every every ring she has, and I’m just waiting to buy the next one. You know, how did that come about? Was that a response to becoming a parent? Or did it happen way after you had your daughter? How did the business evolve?
Anu Sawhney:
It evolved because of a couple of reasons. So I used to work in the fashion industry and only people who actually have experienced that environment know how toxic it is. It’s, you think that corporate is high pressure and toxic? Nah, like, it doesn’t hold a whiff. When it comes to the fashion industry. They are cutthroat, people are rotten people and mean, there’s a lot of backstabbing, it’s and it’s not just with one company, it’s kind of prevalent throughout, I’ve, I’ve yet to meet anyone in the fashion industry who doesn’t think so. And so, one bit was that, and the other was that we, as an industry, we have exceptionally poor with manufacturers, and to me, that used to hurt me, because I’ve seen the other side of it. And I know what taking 10 cents off a product for a manufacturer means. It means that they they have somebody is going to work overtime, and not get paid for it to make the thing so that their margins are higher, it’s not that it’s more affordable at the end line, it’s just that their margins are higher. So the endline, still pays more. There is extreme pressure on the other end, and then you’re just making your margins in between. So that bit always used to really frustrate me because I’m like, Well, you have the margins it takes like $2 off your main margin when you take 10 cents off here. It’s not going to make you a millionaire. It’s not going to make like it’s not going to stop you from being anything. That was one bit. And I’d kind of sworn off business because my parents were business people. And I was like never doing yours. This is not this is not what life should look like. And then, after I had my daughter, I got really sick. And I think I decided to start a business to keep my sanity. But then I also had this inkling at the back of me that as long as I freelance within the industry, I will always face these problems. So this was my solution to not. Being a part of the solution but also keeping my sanity.
Kate Toon:
Okay, that’s great. So we’ve covered a lot there. So it talks about the industry you kind of wanting to have a challenge the industry a little bit, the kind of cutthroat nurse with the with the margins, and the people who suffer the other producers. But then from personal reasons, it fitted with your lifestyle, and and gave you that kind of freedom on autonomy. And I guess, what is was What were you know, when you started off, you’ve talked about your there was a very sort of philosophical, why there that you wanted to be part of the solution, not the problem. There was a bit of a personal why then that it fitted in with your lifestyle around your child, which is largely to do with time, right? Well, what role did money come into? Did you start off thinking, you know, I want to replace my previous income, or I want to hit these goals or was money kind of become more of a factor as time has gone on?
Anu Sawhney:
Some money’s actually become a factor. It became a factor. I knew it wasn’t a factor for the first three years. And the reason for that was that monetarily, I had a pool of money sitting that I knew was kind of like my rainy-day fund
Kate Toon:
Safety blanket.
Anu Sawhney:
Which it was it I’d been building it for years. And it was money invested. It’s it was a whole bunch of things. And this was a particular pool of money. So also, because I’m from India, we get gold. As a part of, you know, every bloody occasion, you turn 18. And your mom gives you a gold chain, you have a child and your mom’s giving you like, you know, more gold. And so that’s always been there. But this was like cashable takeout, use the money kind of money. So I built this pool, and I decided that I’m going to start the business. And within four or five years, if I am touching that pool of money, then I need to shut this thing down.
Kate Toon:
Okay. You gave yourself a boundary. Yeah. You said.
17:35
Anu Sawhney:
Yeah. And I gave myself a very small amount of money to grow, like to start and grow the business. And then I put big boundaries around, what’s a want, and what’s a need in business. And I think I shared this on Facebook as well, that I didn’t have a postbox so the first one and a half years, because to me, that was an unnecessary expense. And so I wouldn’t put like my apartment number, but I’d put the street number. And they’d have to go through like, you know, 150 apartments to find me. But I didn’t do I didn’t do little things like that. Because I felt like you had to reach a certain threshold to be then able to afford that thing. So money to me became earning money from the business. But that came like two and a half years later, where I feel like, okay, it’s gotten to a point where it should start earning me money now that I’m not taking from that. It’s growing. And now it needs to give back to me.
Kate Toon:
Okay, cool. So, again, a few things to take out of that. I think, you know, we talk in the book about how, you know, some people are in the business of having a business for the play of it, like it feels like fun. And the people who kind of generally have success do have that kind of small incremental changes approach, you know, that basically, you wait until you can afford stuff. Sometimes you take a risk, you know, I’m sure sometimes you were making orders, you know, to your manufacturers, you know, which were beyond and you were thinking, well, I will recoup this money. I mean, there is a risk there. But things like personal development and conferences and business cards and PO boxes, you know, they’re not necessary. They’re nice, they make life easier. And it’s about balancing out the ease versus the cost. One thing I remember was, I constantly was reducing the amount of files I kept on my Google Drive because I didn’t want to have to pay for the next level up. And it was like $8 and I was spending hours deleting. I was like, What are you doing? So it’s hard sometimes to you can get in such a kind of not not a poverty mindset, but a rationing mindset that it holds you back. So it’s a fine balance, isn’t it between the two?
Anu Sawhney:
Yeah, oh absolutely. So I did some of the stuff in the first year as well. And, and I think my biggest expense in the first two years was the Recipe Course.
Kate Toon:
Oh my course, oh great. That makes me feel bad.
Anu Sawhney:
Because, no, no. And it was because when I read about it, I went from doing the 10 Day Challenge. So the first thing I did was the 10 Day Challenge. And then I found out about Nibbles, like two months later.
Kate Toon:
Probably didn’t exist, then I built them in reverse order. So yeah.
Anu Sawhney:
Oh did you?
Kate Toon:
Yeah.
Anu Sawhney:
I did the 10 Day Challenge. And then after that, I kind of like, went, I want to do more of this, like, this looks like, this looks great. This is what I think I need. And so I, I still took that I still took from that pool of money that I had to run the business, it’s just that I then said, Oh, this is my product money that I’m putting towards the recipe course. And so now I have to find the money to make more product. And so product is your dead end cost where you know, your, your think you have to order it, even though it might not be necessarily selling, you know, at that time. And you just have to keep doing it because you have to keep adding inventory. And you have to keep building. And you still need to do that. So that the Recipe course was my big expense.
Kate Toon:
Extravagance. I want to dig into the money a little bit, because I think money is super important, right? Productivity, super important. Money is really important. Do you feel that when I mean, you sound you know, like money’s always been something you’ve been conscious of, and but did when did you kind of do the work to really sit down and go, This is my product, this is my revenue, this is my profit, these products have more margin than these products. This is why I’m spending on expenses. Because you know, again, I’ll be honest, I did none of that in the first two or three years, I was just bumbling about doing my thing. And it wasn’t until I sat down. And did that work that I really started to feel like my business had longevity in life. And I could see the effort paying off because until then I was like, why don’t I have more money? Like where is it all? I’m working really hard. When did you start doing that deeper work on understanding your financials?
Anu Sawhney:
I’d say like maybe two and a half years.
Kate Toon:
Same then, yeah.
Anu Sawhney:
That said in the beginning, I had my costings, right, because they come from the industry, I know how to cost. Yeah. And so I it was always built for profits. So everything I sold, was making me a profit. And, but I didn’t do the deep work till two and a half years later, where you take what you have, and you take what’s sitting in your account, and you see what’s sitting in terms of inventory, and then you see what’s selling, what isn’t, and picking an actual direction for the business. I had like, three different styles of design at the top of the business. And then I narrowed it down to that one style at two and a half years, I kind of did away with all the other stuff.
Kate Toon:
Isn’t it funny that you know, sometimes? Again, this is a business lesson, isn’t it? We think that range is everything and having so many different products. But sometimes specificity is more profitable. You know, it’s so funny.
Anu Sawhney:
Yeah, absolutely.
Kate Toon:
And looking at all your products and going this one actually, yes, it makes me a bit of money, but the margin’s terrible compared to this. So I need to put my energies here. And I think, you know, ecommerce is a unique beast, as you said, because you’ve always got that running sitting cost of all the inventory, that sitting there, you know, and that can weigh on you. And it can, especially if you choose a particular product line, or you develop a particular product, and it doesn’t sell and it’s like, ah, you know, how do you cope with that, you said, this risk of buying product?
Anu Sawhney:
Sometimes I don’t cope with it. I literally go like, why? This is brilliant. What’s wrong with people? That’s what I do sometimes. And sometimes I literally go like, initially, it was one of the it was some of the most unexpected stuff to me that sold. It wasn’t the, you know, the detailed pieces, it was the simple straightforward, structured pieces that were selling. And that kind of taught me a lesson because I always, in design, like the intricacy is a good thing. But that’s not where my business was taking me. Sometimes you just have to accept that it’s not doing well.
Kate Toon:
Yeah,
Anu Sawhney:
It doesn’t go down well.
Kate Toon:
You move on.
Anu Sawhney:
Yeah, but you made an equal amount of effort as you did when you were you know, doing a simple design to when you do a tough design to then make that work because there’s a lot more science involved in a tougher design. We have to get the balance right, because it can’t be wonky. You can’t put a stone on the end of a hoop and then have the weight make it move forward. You have to place it at a certain spot so it stays in the in its in its, you know, in its place. But yeah, You don’t sometimes you just don’t cope with it. Sometimes screaming shouting, throwing a tantrum is exactly what you need to do.
Kate Toon:
Sometimes you need to let it all out. Well, let’s talk about this combination of business and parenting. We talked about your parenting side of things. We talked about the business side, even now, how did they come together? What for you, if you could pick one thing, what has been the biggest challenge for you as a parent running a business?
Anu Sawhney:
Time? Isn’t that what everybody says?
Kate Toon:
No.
Anu Sawhney:
Time, lack of time, like, there’s only 24 hours in a day. And there’s just, you still do need to sleep. I go on, like five hours of sleep a night most nights, which is terrible. But time, like I wish I had more time.
Kate Toon:
I think while it’s not always the answer that I’ve been given, I think it is the biggest area that we can make change, like people often look at money, it’s the first thing to turn, the time is the one and really, I’ve devoted the biggest section of the book to productivity and expectations. Because really, we all have enough time. It’s not really about time, it’s about patience. And that’s the hard thing for people to do. You know, like I used to say in the beginning, if I could just get one week where nothing happens, and no one’s sick. And if I could just get – Imagine if I had 40 hours to work on my business what it could be. And then the reframe I had to do was I do have 40 hours, not in a week, for maybe over three weeks, I didn’t have that time, I just need to manage my expectations, and not be so hard on myself and not judge myself by my productivity. So I love that it was your thing, because I think it’s the area where we can actually make small changes that make a massive difference. You have to read the book to find out what they are. Now, part of the time thing is always feeling slightly torn into, like, when you’re working your business feel guilty about not being with family when you’re with your family or like Oh god, I really should be getting on with this. How do you manage that parent guilt and kind of segmenting your life? Or do you?
Anu Sawhney:
I do and I subcontract. I don’t clean. I stopped cooking two and a half years ago. So now when I cook my kids think it’s a big deal.
Kate Toon:
What the hell. Oh, yeah.
Anu Sawhney:
And they are like sitting at the edge of the table waiting because I’m a really good cook. I hate cooking, but I’m a really good cook. And I realized that I was spending far too much time in the kitchen that I actually wanted to spend with my kids. And I was overthinking other things while I was in the kitchen and I didn’t want to do that. I was overthinking about business. I was overthinking like kids, I was doing life admin in my head. And these things were driving me crazy. But I subcontract as much as I can. I I stopped cleaning. That was one of the first things I did when I moved to Australia and I started earning I have not cleaned my own apartment for as long as I can remember, it was one of it was a non negotiable for me, because I thought this is like three hours a week that is totally wasted. And I am way more valuable in our time to do this. And this is better spent on myself. So I got a cleaner a long time ago, I have a cook who comes once a week.
Kate Toon:
That’s brilliant.
Anu Sawhney:
I, also, during the pandemic, I also got a robovac.
Kate Toon:
Oh, the robovac is the way forward. Although my dog doesn’t like it. I love that now, you know, obviously, as soon as we talk about having any kind of stuff, people speak to privilege and wealth and also a mindset shift because for some people, you know, I grew up in northern England working class, the idea of having a cleaner would be a complete anathema. Like, who the hell do you think you are? And it took me a lot to get over that my cleaner has a cleaner. So it’s all about how you want to spend your time you know, not that you’re a better person or that you’re more valuable than the person cleaning your flat. But you’ve making that choice. And yes, there are compromises maybe there been times when I’ve paid for my cleaner. And I’ve gone without for other things because that’s important to me, but I love what you mentioned there about the food thing, because actually-
Anu Sawhney:
Well actually the thing was it came about because that there was so much going on. There’s a newborn in the house. There is no support system because I I’m not I wasn’t born and brought up here. And so having a parent or having family at hand wasn’t an option. There’s no neighbors dropping off pots of food for you when there’s a little child. And the other thing really was that when when you’re in that state of desperation where you don’t have the time or the energy to cook you order food and ordering food is expensive. It is so much more expensive than having someone come and cook for you once a week. And so to me, monetarily, also it made sense, because you could spend way more on takeaway and you’re eating rubbish. Whereas here, you’re paying somebody to cook with the ingredients that you bought cooking the food that you want to eat, and your refrigerator is stocked the I think there’s way different ways of looking at it.
Kate Toon:
Yeah. Oh, absolutely. And, you know, I think as well, there’s a lot, especially for mothers ingrained in it, you know, you should be cooking for your children, you should be keeping house because that’s the traditional mode. And it’s like, why, why, why we don’t have those expectations of dads, necessarily. So I love that approach. Also, the big thing for me with food was this, just like with everything else, there’s so much pressure to make brilliant meals. And at the end of the day, even now, you know, my son really likes the rotation of having the same meals every week. He likes to routine, he likes the predictability, I may fancier, Thai curry with blobby blue, blue, blue, but he just wants pretty much quite simple food. And yet, we’ve put such high expectations on ourselves to be like, you know, a gourmet cook. So food. I love that, and the cleaner. We talked about time being a big thing for you. And obviously, something you’re continuing to work on, especially having a two-year-old is full of beans. Do you have a productivity tip you could share with the listeners?
Anu Sawhney:
I prioritize the five most important things during the week. And I only try and get to those by the end of the week. Everything else is kind of not that important.
Kate Toon:
It’s a real clarity around. And how do you determine those those five things?
Anu Sawhney:
Usually it’s it’s to do with what it means to future plan. So because I’m a product business, I have to plan for when is the next delivery coming in. Am I meeting deadline for my suppliers to then have enough time. So a lot of it is driven by that. And the second, or maybe the first now most important thing is how much money it makes me.
Kate Toon:
Yeah.
Anu Sawhney:
So it’s the focus on do the thing that actually converts either gets you more customers, or makes you more money, which sometimes is the same thing. Sometimes it isn’t because even if you nurture existing customers that that can make you a hell of a lot of money for a lot less effort. And so, focus on the money making and focus on what I need to do to make sure that I’m catching timeline for the future.
Kate Toon:
Perfect. That’s exactly my mentality as well. I always try and make the first thing I do each day, something that makes me money. But even that could be invoicing, it could be sticking labels on parcels that are being sent out. But it’s not frippery, and it’s not Frou Frou. And I try to pick things where the ROI is as close to the action as possible. Because yes, I know writing a blog post may one day attract someone’s attention, who then made join my list, who then may buy a customer, but I could do you know, call one loyal customer and talk to them. And that can have a bigger impact. So that and that takes time. And that takes practice to work out what that is. Let’s talk about communication as a whole section of the book devoted to communication. And, you know, we cover how to talk to your children about your job and but also dealing with partners. Not everyone has a partner, obviously, and that can be a blessing or a curse. You know, does your partner have, I know you have a partner. So I’m not making assumptions here people? Do they have a real a real job? Do they? And how sympathetic are they to your business?
Anu Sawhney:
Not very even boring. Something is later my husband thinks this is just he doesn’t understand what I’m doing. But also, I’ve taken up the expectation that he will one day understand what I’m doing. And that’s okay, I think he, for him to manage that expectation is for him to manage. I don’t understand what he does in his real job to be honest. And sometimes when I overhear things, I was like, I can’t believe it. You’re making money off of people’s insurance. This is just terrible. You know insurance is a scam, don’t you? And he’s like, Yeah, whatever. You have no idea what I’m talking about. But it’s the same thing. I actually don’t understand what he does. And that’s okay. And I think and I think that’s acceptable, isn’t it?
Kate Toon:
I actually love that I just made a little note on my pad. Because it’s so important because I think when it’s our business, it feels like an extension of ourselves. And it’s much more personal and intimate than having a job, although obviously a lot of people do identify through their careers. If you’re physically producing stuff, whether its product or its copy or its design is intrinsically part of you and your character. Therefore there’s a bigger need for people to understand it. Because if they don’t understand that, do they really understand you. But we don’t put that expectations on people’s jobs.
Anu Sawhney:
No.
Kate Toon:
You know, it’s weird. So I love that, you know, yes, you’re trying to communicate it to him. But you’ve also managed the stories you tell yourself that my partner doesn’t need to understand every aspect of my business for me to keep going with it. Is it also a little bit about, I don’t know, approval and affirmation? Like, we want our partner to be interested and care about our business, but maybe they worried about their own stuff.
Anu Sawhney:
Like, I think when you’re in when you have a real job, you do your nine to five, and then you might like, in his case, he might have deliveries, and then he’s working weekends and things like that where you have, you just have to get to the end of that. But businesses 24/7, but also that, for the first maybe one one and a half years, I very desperately wanted him to be a part of it. And for him to understand it. And then I don’t know how or when, but I got to the realization that he just doesn’t get it. And that’s okay. Because I actually don’t get what he does either.
Kate Toon:
That’s very freeing. And I think there’s kind of I can imagine, like, the two kind of pillars of confidence and kind of experience like in the early days, when you’re not confident in your business, you do seek more affirmation, you do want people to understand it more because you’re wobbly. But as you’ve grown more confident and become less wobbly, you don’t need the support of others so much. You’re like okay you don’t get it.
Anu Sawhney:
But also there’s community, right? So when you join, even if you don’t do like the Recipe Course, but you have a community like Misfits, where there are people who get what you’re doing, because they’re in the same position, you then have a sense of, you have a sense of belonging, even though you might not know these people, because you know, there are others like you out there.
Kate Toon:
Yeah, we’re not just weird, or other people who get it. And you know, that that kind of acceptance that we all kind of have that your partner can’t be all things, you know, they can’t be your best friend and your leather, and your you know, raising a kid together and they can’t be everything. And I’m speaking everything in one person just in be a recipe for disaster. And so I love that you’ve managed your expectations that you know, that is a communication tip because it’s communication with yourself. Right?
Anu Sawhney:
Oh yeah, absolutely.
Kate Toon:
Yeah. And we, you know, we talk a lot in DMC about, you know, family and our kids and, you know, do you have any aspirations to get your or does your daughter already Is she involved in the business, you want it to be involved in the business?
Anu Sawhney:
Well she does bits of it, she does. She helps with like the packing and the, you know, the segregation, and she’ll go build the boxes, when we’re packing orders, or she’ll like put stickers on things and stuff like that. So lit, she does little things. She used to do a lot of unboxing videos with me, not so much anymore, because I unbox in the middle of the night, she’s usually fast asleep. But she does bits and bobs here and there. Again, no real expectations, because I don’t think she’s old enough to understand that, you know, this is a part of what she needs to do.
Kate Toon:
Yeah, and I think it’s funny, because at nine, my son was the same, he would do some stickers and whatever. But he didn’t understand the bigger picture. Now that he’s 13. He definitely does. And he, it was for him, it was really a pivotal point where he really wanted something. And I, you know, got to the point where I’m like, maybe again, my parents upbringing, you know, after about 12, I’m not just going to buy you stuff. Like if you want stuff you can save for it, you’re old enough to get the concept of money, and also the pleasure delay and working towards stuff. So when he decided that he wanted a computer and I said look, I got I’m not gonna buy that for you. I can’t afford it. Or even if I could afford it, I don’t want to buy it. That was the pivotal point where he went, alright, well, maybe I could do work for you. And he started off thinking I’m gonna go mow people’s lawns. But he didn’t want to do that. And then he actually started his own little video business, which he kind of enjoyed that he didn’t really enjoy liaising with clients, which I get. He’s 13. So now he’s an employee of my business. He’s actually on the payroll. He’s got set jobs to do every week. But the thing I think that you mentioned that it’s so important is expectation that I waited for him to come to me. Yeah, it was really, really important because then he actually came willingly rather than being dragged. So yeah, maybe she’ll take on the family business. You never know.
Anu Sawhney:
I don’t know, we’ve been having a lot of discussions around what she’d liked to be lately.
Kate Toon:
Yeah. She got any ideas?
Anu Sawhney:
She wants to become a pilot.
Kate Toon:
I love that.
Anu Sawhney:
And I told her that’s great. Because I get like, free flight tickets. Yeah.
Kate Toon:
My son wants to be like an international financial economist or something like that. I’m like, that sounds good to me dude. Sounds great to me. So you know, obviously, I would say having a two year old is one of the most challenging times of parenting right? You know, it’s funny writing the book because obviously I’m calling upon my memories of having a baby and having a toddler. It is dramatically easier now in terms of time. But it there is a lot of heads head stuff to deal with, with teenagers, you know, how do you? How do you manage that? And how do you manage your own self care? When you’re, you know, you’re being a mom, and there’s barely enough time to be a mom, and then you’re being a business owner, where does self-care come in for you?
Anu Sawhney:
So I usually when I’m when I’m getting to a point where I just need to do something for myself, or just take a break, I have a group of friends that go out for a movie every week. And all I have to do is message and say, I’m in this week, and I just shut down and I just go. Like I literally like stop and 95% of the time, I don’t even know what movie we’re going for. Because I just walk in as I get whatever, let’s just go. And it just allows me to shut down completely. It’s just one of those things where my family knows where I am. And so they will not send me a message, they will not call me. They know that this is like two hours where you know, she’s just sitting and watching a movie. So don’t trouble her, and there’s no expectation. You’re just sitting. And the last thing I saw was Whitney,
Kate Toon:
Oh I want to see that.
Anu Sawhney:
Which is pretty good. Yeah. And you just allowed to you just allow yourself to not be present for anybody else.
Kate Toon:
Yeah. And what a great what a great group of friends that don’t have the expectation don’t nag you when you can’t make it. Because that’s also real, you know, friends are great. But sometimes friends can be a mental load as well trying to be the friend they want you to be.
Anu Sawhney:
So this is like a really large group. It’s a WhatsApp group of like 20 people. And usually, they’re like five or six people. So you, you don’t know which set of friends will show up either. But it’s all kind of the same where your mind is shut down, because you’re watching a movie. And so you’re not thinking about all the things you can do. And your family’s not going to trouble you. Because you don’t know, your ad for dinner, and you’re still messaging people. And they just allow you to, like be.
Kate Toon:
That sounds lovely. That sounds great. And sometimes, you know, it’s about just being able to shut off the brain for a little bit that internal narrative that’s comforting, like, Yeah, but you could you could, you could, because obviously business, as you said is 24/7, it’s endless. There’s always more you could be doing. And just being able to sort of not get that kind of panicky chest feeling and just let it slide for a little bit and let the family slide for a little bit. But you’re safe. They know where you are so good. That sounds like a fantastic opportunity. So I mean, it sounds like you have a busy life, you have a business that’s, you know, going well. I mean, I’ve obviously we’ve been friends for a long time now. And I’ve seen your business evolve. And now you have this secondary aspects, where you’re also writing product copy and doing a bit of SEO and working on that. So you’ve definitely got a lot going on. What, the big question, but what drives you to keep going, you know, why haven’t you given up and gone and got a job for the man, it would be a lot easier on you. Why do you keep pushing?
Anu Sawhney:
Because it’s more fun, isn’t it? It’s more fun when you get to when you get to see something when you get to build something out of nothing. It’s a lot more satisfying than jumping on someone else’s wagon and making a small change. Which you I mean, it’s not really about remembrance, either. It’s just building the something from nothing, which is just so much fun. I think it’s so much fun.
Kate Toon:
I love that, the fun is important. The money is important, all of those are important, but the fun is important. It’s my three circles, will it make me money? Do people want it? And most importantly, will I enjoy it. And the let’s wrap up with a final tip, if someone is listening to this, and maybe they’re planning a family, and they’re thinking having a small business at the same time might be a good idea. Or they’re in a day job that they don’t like, and they’re not spending enough time with their family and they feel like having their own business might be the way forward. What is your tip for how to have a successful business and still be a good parent?
Anu Sawhney:
I think have a pool of money that you can go back to and build that even if it’s a small one. But then when you do have a baby I say you give up and you hire people and you get them to do the thing because it’ll actually save you more money in the long run. It is actually it’s actually more beneficial for you. It allows you to go to sleep at night. It allows you You go watch a movie instead of doing dishes, but just be nicer to yourself really like someone else can do the dishes. Someone else can do this extra work for you. It pays to do that in the long run.
Kate Toon:
I love that. Well, thank you very much for coming on the show today. Anu. Where can we find out more about your business?
Anu Sawhney:
I’m on Instagram or Facebook or TikTok, I don’t go on TikTok. But about me, you can connect with me on LinkedIn or you can just follow one of my business accounts and they’re all Bidiliia. So b i d i l double i a. And it’s the same across all social.
Kate Toon:
Well, we’ll include links to those in the show notes for this episode. Annie, thank you so much for talking to us today.
Anu Sawhney:
You’re very welcome. Thank you for having me.
